Light, Truth and Free Speech with Guest Barry Culligan

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Welcome to the Urantia Radio
Podcast.

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My name is Jim Watkins, the
host, longtime student and

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reader of the 5th epical
Revelation, and we have a very,

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very special podcast.
I have a great guest coming on

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board.
I ran across an article written

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by Barry Culligan.
It appeared in the Urantia

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Fellowship Mini Messenger e-mail
that I subscribe to and it has

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to do with freedom of speech and
how today there seems to be an

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effort being put forth by
governments that censorship is

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somehow acceptable in order to
keep the peace.

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Now Barry's insightful article
declares that this is not the

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way our universe rulers deal
with things, as illustrated by

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the events of the Lucifer
rebellion in the Urantia book,

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which is depicted in great
detail.

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Let me read the introduction to
Barry's essay, then we will talk

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to Barry about this and other
Urantia book topics which I know

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you will enjoy.
And this is what Barry writes on

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the subject of rebellion and
free speech.

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He says we find ourselves in the
Information age, in which there

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is a preponderance of data but a
veritable famine of wisdom.

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Each age has its very own
modalities, often marked off by

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weaponry and or technology.
In the information age, the

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weapon of choice is information.
Noam Chomsky once said that

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quote what violence is to a
dictatorship, propaganda is to a

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democracy.
It is a means used by the few to

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achieve specific desires, goals
and ambitions.

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It is a weapon used to control
perception, construct

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narratives, to frame discourse,
with the aim being to persuade,

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to convince.
The Urantia book gives an

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interesting analysis of the
evolution of prayer and magic,

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of white magic and black magic.
They point out that there are

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both public and a private phase
to magic that, performed by the

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medicine man, shaman or priest
was supposed to be for the good

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of the whole tribe.
Meanwhile, witches, sorcerers,

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and Wizards dispensed private
magic, personal and selfish

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magic, which was employed as a
coercive method of bringing evil

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on one's enemies.
This distinction between the

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public and the private sphere is
key, Berry writes.

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Once evil plans are made public,
they quickly are destroyed.

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One's information about the
unsavory machinations, nefarious

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designs, and the intentions of
the wicked make it to the public

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square.
Their cards are marked and their

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plans are soon brought to
naughty.

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The common man has a sense of
fairness, and when it becomes

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apparent that a small minority
are working to the detriment of

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the whole tribe, that wicked
minority becomes the focal point

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of the vengeance of the whole
tribe.

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Consequently, the wicked have
always had a vested interest in

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perception management.
They cannot allow their plans to

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see the light of day because if
they know, if Joe Public becomes

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aware of them, the jig will be
up.

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The sanitizing nature of the
public square is akin to a sort

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of immune system and teaches us
that the longer issues remain

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hidden and undetected, the
greater damage they can do.

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It struck me, he writes, how the
Divine manages their public

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square.
For them, the sooner issues are

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exposed, the quicker they can be
dealt with.

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Jesus had No Fear of truth.
Indeed, He taught that the

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recognition of truth would make
us free and admonished his

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followers to be patient, for the
truth never suffers from honest

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examination.
And with that, we introduce our

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guest to talk about free speech
and the light of truth here on

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the Iranian Radio Podcast with
my guest, Barry Culligan.

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Barry is in Ireland.
And how long have you been a

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your Rancho Book reader?
Hi Jim, thanks very much for

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having me.
I appreciate the chance to speak

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with you.
I've been a long time listener

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to your podcast.
Oh, thank you.

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So it's, it's kind of fun to
actually end up talking to you.

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It's cool.
So I am stuck in the West of

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Ireland.
I live in a place in County

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Galway, just West of Galway City
in a place called Uktar, which

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is known as the gateway to
Conomera and Connemara is the

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wild, wild lands of Ireland.
So along the West Coast of

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Ireland there was there was the
same said once that for every

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mile you go West of Dublin, you
go a year back in time.

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So by the time you reach the
West of Ireland, the very ages,

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you're 150 years back it's.
Amazing.

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And in a sense, it's a bit like
that.

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There are wild and Pagan out the
West, but so I'm right on the

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edges there, stricting the city
and the the countryside as it

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was.
And I've been living here now

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for a good number of years.
I've married with two kids.

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I lost my heart to a Galway
girl, as the song goes.

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And so we're living in a
beautiful part of, of Ireland

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and I've been here for a long
time.

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So my, I first encountered the
Urantia book 20 odd years ago, I

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think it was around 2024 years
ago.

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I had been studying philosophy
and theology in college.

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And while there I, I, it's like
I'd make a Long story short just

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to save you trouble.
And so basically ended up

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researching process theology.
And when I went on to check out

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process theology, when the first
thing that came up was a link to

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the entity book.
And I was like, what, how was

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this connected?
What, what is this thing?

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And it was very, there was a
fellow, an Australian fellow.

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He used to have a thing called
the lighthouse something he was

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fairly well known anti book
reader at the time, an advocate.

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And he had this website and
this, it's linked to the, the

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teachings.
And I started kind of posing and

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then I spotted the discourse and
true religion, and it blew my

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world apart.
I thought.

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I thought it was just amazing
because I had been, I've been

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kind of at a crossroads
spiritually in my life.

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You know, I had found Jesus and
I was delighted that I found

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Jesus.
But I was very, very

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disconcerted by the traditions
surrounding the life of Jesus.

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You know, I had a very great,
great difficulty with the

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atonement doctrine.
It just didn't seem to add up to

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me, you know, and eventually I
kind of had reached a point in

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my life where I just said to
Jesus, I said, look, I can't

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figure out what the answer is.
You have me.

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That's no problem.
You're a God.

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You can figure out how to help
me find the truth.

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You, you can lead me through
this.

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And within a month, I had the
energy book in my hands.

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And that was all she wrote.
And I've been reading the book

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every day for the last 25 years
since, you know.

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You know, it's funny, you
mentioned the discourse on

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religion.
It was at that moment where I

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threw in the intellectual towel,
as they say, and it was that

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same, I think it's paper 155.
And that that to me gave gave

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validity to what I was reading.
I felt at that moment that

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whoever wrote the book
absolutely had access to the

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truth.
It just resonated so much.

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So I think that's interesting
that that also spoke to you as

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well.
Like it was it for me.

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It was terrifying to read
because my heart desperately

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wanted it to be true.
But at the same time, if it was

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true, then that means this book
was an actual revelation.

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Like an actual for real
revelation, like, Oh my God, how

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do you how do you, how do you
deal with that?

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You know, what does that mean?
What does that mean for your

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life?
Like, you know, it's like Philip

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and Nathaniel, you know,
happened to bump into the

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Messiah on the way to the boats.
You know, it's like, how do you

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deal with that?
Like, you know, this is this has

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happened to you.
So in my case, I found this book

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and I was I was like shaking at
the Todd like this is just to be

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the real thing.
This to be really.

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And I would was a fight in my
heart for a long time kind of

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saying, yes, it is.
No one isn't yes, it is.

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No one isn't.
Oh my God, what am I going to

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do, you know?
But eventually I was like, this

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is the real thing, man.
This is the real deal.

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And I have been devotedly
reading it now since, you know,

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hardly a days past and I haven't
been in the book.

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It's a wonderful story really,
and you also have the pleasure

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of working with a group.
You help with the local church.

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And you, you 20 or so?
What did you say, nuns?

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Yeah, so I'm a community leader,
community leader for nuns in, in

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Galway.
So for the last year I didn't.

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So I'm, I'm, I'm an honorary nun
now amongst the ladies in

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Galway.
They, I'm the, I'm the Mother

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Superior, the Brother Superior.
And so they, they've accepted me

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and schooled me for the last
year.

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And they're a wonderful,
wonderful bunch.

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And it's been fascinating
working with them because, you

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know, I would have been far from
that side of religious life, but

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it's very interesting to, to see
a community of women who've

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devoted their whole lives to the
Lord and to service, you know,

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and what they gave up and what
they gained and what they did.

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And, uh, I find it fascinating
too, because these are people

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like, you know, who career
professionals say, like, you

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know, that you're talking about
school principals, matrons,

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social workers, heads of
department.

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And they were getting, you know,
the, the same money anybody else

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would get to those jobs, except
every single penny was given

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over to the order, you know, and
they were given a stipend each

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month to keep them tipping on,
you know, so they lived a life

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and service for the handed over
every penny.

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And I look at that, the
devotion, the commitment that

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they've had.
And I kind of wonder where in

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the your anti book community
could we emulate that, you know,

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because we don't have, you know,
yourself, the your anti book

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community doesn't have a
religion or the other name yet.

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Like, you know, and how can we
as a community come together

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religiously?
And I think about that and I

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kind of reflect on the lives
that the nuns have lived and how

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that might be used to inform the
the spiritual and religious

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evolution of the Unity book
community.

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So that's things that I enjoy
kind of reflecting on.

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Do you feel, do you ever feel
compelled to share the fact that

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you have the Urantia book with
these people that you work with?

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Or do you feel that sort of not
really because it would could

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could create a little conflict,
couldn't?

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You know the deal, Jim.
This book is sent ahead of his

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time.
Nobody wants this book.

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Nobody wants this book and I've
tried it.

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Of course they do.
They do appreciate the

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teachings.
If you can, if you can as a, as

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a said, you know, breakdown the
grains of truth to make it into

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an acceptable form for the
spiritually hungry.

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There's so much in the book.
There's so much in the book to

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enrich and ennoble and
strengthen and invigorate

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spiritually anybody you
encounter.

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You just have to be able to, to
to translate the book into a

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language they can understand.
And that's why sometimes I find

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when I see your anti book forums
or prodigy of through themselves

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and it's like everybody can
teach an alien talking like

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that.
You know, you're not you're not

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connecting with them at their
level.

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I I do no more than yourself.
I've tried to do the whole

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podcasting, you know, but very
cheap version of it.

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But I did one called about the
the, the duties of the shepherd

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and the duties of the shepherds
to feed, to find and to send and

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the so when it comes to taking
care of a flock, you've got to

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feed them.
You've got to give them

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spiritual inertia.
You've got to find them.

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So people get lost and like life
is confusing, frightening and

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bewildering.
And you have to learn to listen

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to people.
And when you learn to listen to

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people, then you can help them.
You can't help them unless you

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listen.
You know from the sheep are

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lost.
You have to sit down, stay

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silent and try to find out what
direction did they go in.

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You can wander off in any
direction.

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It's not necessarily going to be
helpful, but if you listen,

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you'll get a hint of how you can
go and where you can go to, to

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be a greatest service, you know,
to the person that needs it the

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most.
So yeah.

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It's, you know, the last time I,
my last episode, I, I read just

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one or two sections on the home
life of Jesus.

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And, and it talks a lot about
Jesus's parents and what they

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00:12:40,760 --> 00:12:43,720
were like.
And I, and I've only read maybe

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00:12:43,720 --> 00:12:47,200
that passage 20 times.
And every time I read it, it

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00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:50,720
reaches out to me in a new way.
And I feel like there's somebody

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out there that has never heard
the story of Joseph.

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00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:57,320
They don't, you know, or the
relationship that Jesus had with

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00:12:57,320 --> 00:13:00,320
his parents, some of the
characteristics that they got

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that he got from his parents.
And I thought, my God, that if

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I, if I was searching for, for
something and I heard somebody

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00:13:07,640 --> 00:13:12,920
tell me that story, I might just
be inclined to say, man, that's

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00:13:12,920 --> 00:13:15,080
pretty spectacular.
And, and it happens all the

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00:13:15,080 --> 00:13:17,960
time.
We're just a passage, one little

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passage.
And it's, you could walk around

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00:13:20,240 --> 00:13:23,320
for a week just thinking about
one little passage.

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That's how powerful this book is
sometimes, I think.

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00:13:27,680 --> 00:13:32,400
Yeah, but again, it's people
have to be, have to be in the

240
00:13:32,400 --> 00:13:34,280
right place at the right time
for it.

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00:13:34,440 --> 00:13:38,000
You know, if people are not
searching, people are not

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00:13:38,000 --> 00:13:41,760
seekers, then you can't give
them the book because they it's,

243
00:13:41,760 --> 00:13:43,160
it's, it's a waste of time for
them.

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00:13:43,160 --> 00:13:45,320
You know, people have to be
spiritually hungry.

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00:13:45,880 --> 00:13:48,640
I think, you know, and at that
point in my life, I was, I was

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00:13:48,640 --> 00:13:52,560
really like highly motivated,
you know, I had been through

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00:13:52,960 --> 00:13:57,280
some very profound spiritual
experiences and, and really, I

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00:13:57,280 --> 00:13:59,880
really wanted to kind of have a
proper deep connection with,

249
00:13:59,880 --> 00:14:02,800
with the, with God and life and
Jesus.

250
00:14:02,800 --> 00:14:05,520
And that book really opened it
up for me.

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But like, I've, I've given away
how many of the books and like

252
00:14:08,760 --> 00:14:11,440
they just, they used to hold
open doors, you know, the big

253
00:14:11,440 --> 00:14:14,640
every book like, and it's so
it's so disappointing because

254
00:14:14,640 --> 00:14:17,040
you think, Oh my God, you've got
so much treasure in your hands

255
00:14:17,040 --> 00:14:20,200
and you just don't see it.
So, but for me, the, the, the

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00:14:20,200 --> 00:14:23,560
key has been to learn how to,
to, to present it in a way that

257
00:14:23,560 --> 00:14:27,440
is attractive to, to present
the, the truths in an acceptable

258
00:14:27,440 --> 00:14:29,040
fashion.
And I can be.

259
00:14:29,160 --> 00:14:31,360
I've been pretty successful at
that, you know.

260
00:14:31,520 --> 00:14:34,240
Yeah.
So let's talk a little bit about

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00:14:34,240 --> 00:14:36,480
what's happening right now in
the world.

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00:14:36,920 --> 00:14:40,840
And we're watching it on TV,
although over here, you would be

263
00:14:40,840 --> 00:14:45,400
surprised, Barry, at how little
coverage our our American media

264
00:14:45,800 --> 00:14:49,640
is giving over what's happening
in in particularly London.

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00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:52,600
But certainly you're affected
because you're part of the UK.

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00:14:53,240 --> 00:14:56,960
But even this conversation, I
thought of, of the fact that it

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00:14:56,960 --> 00:15:00,400
could be dangerous if we were,
if you were to say the wrong

268
00:15:00,400 --> 00:15:02,560
thing.
So I have to, I don't know.

269
00:15:02,560 --> 00:15:05,000
I think I have to be careful
because they're coming up with

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00:15:05,000 --> 00:15:09,000
these laws now where they can
arrest you if you say the wrong

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00:15:09,000 --> 00:15:13,720
things on a social media post or
and, and, and, and I want to get

272
00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:16,160
to.
Your article, because they're

273
00:15:16,280 --> 00:15:18,960
going to have to, they have to
pick on, they have to pick their

274
00:15:18,960 --> 00:15:21,600
Baptist because there's too many
people saying the wrong thing.

275
00:15:21,760 --> 00:15:25,200
You know, they can't arrest
everybody and the court systems

276
00:15:25,200 --> 00:15:29,240
couldn't function like, you
know, so eventually there's

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00:15:29,240 --> 00:15:31,120
going to be too many people
speaking the truth anyway.

278
00:15:31,120 --> 00:15:33,760
So you have to speak the truth
that you have moral obligation

279
00:15:33,760 --> 00:15:35,040
to speak the truth.
Yeah.

280
00:15:35,240 --> 00:15:39,720
You know, and I mean like the
Spirit within you will wrestle

281
00:15:39,720 --> 00:15:42,720
with you if you allow fear to
hold you back.

282
00:15:43,200 --> 00:15:46,200
You know, if you will not
preach, if you will not admit

283
00:15:46,200 --> 00:15:49,800
the truth to fear, and if you're
not serving God, then you know

284
00:15:50,320 --> 00:15:54,080
you have a problem.
So in your article Afraid of

285
00:15:54,080 --> 00:15:55,800
that?
Yeah, Let me read just a little

286
00:15:55,800 --> 00:16:00,520
bit, share with the listeners.
You you talk about during the

287
00:16:00,520 --> 00:16:04,080
rebellion, the Lucifer
rebellion, that there was no

288
00:16:04,080 --> 00:16:09,720
attempt made to shut down or
censor or in any way affect

289
00:16:09,720 --> 00:16:13,360
Lucifer's proclamation liberty,
which is what set the whole

290
00:16:13,360 --> 00:16:16,480
rebellion in in motion.
And you talk about the

291
00:16:16,480 --> 00:16:20,840
sanitizing nature of the public
square and how it's sort of acts

292
00:16:20,840 --> 00:16:24,560
like an immune system response
because when things are

293
00:16:24,560 --> 00:16:29,200
discussed out in the open, there
are no secrets that the light of

294
00:16:29,200 --> 00:16:33,400
truth will take care of the the
misinformation, if you will.

295
00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:36,720
Because of the darkness and evil
to recoil, they can't live in

296
00:16:36,720 --> 00:16:40,480
the light of truth.
And so why do you think that

297
00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:44,400
people, Is it because people
want secret societies?

298
00:16:44,400 --> 00:16:48,520
Is it because the powerful want
people to be kept in the dark

299
00:16:48,520 --> 00:16:51,520
and so they don't want them
asking the right questions?

300
00:16:51,520 --> 00:16:55,720
Or, well, is this all to be?
Learned by evil I mean they

301
00:16:55,720 --> 00:16:58,480
can't.
Umm, is this sorry?

302
00:16:58,480 --> 00:17:00,240
Is this all driven by evil?
Is that what you said?

303
00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:06,040
Yeah, or the fear of the truth.
Certainly, I'd say the driven by

304
00:17:06,040 --> 00:17:10,319
selfish intention, you know, and
prosecuted by nefarious means,

305
00:17:11,880 --> 00:17:16,640
the like, if you can't say it
openly if you'd like.

306
00:17:17,000 --> 00:17:21,920
I mean, if you've got a plan to
reduce the quality of life for a

307
00:17:21,920 --> 00:17:26,040
million people, you know,
dramatically, then they might

308
00:17:26,040 --> 00:17:29,160
object to that plan.
You know, if they become aware

309
00:17:29,160 --> 00:17:32,720
of the fact that you've got
something in play which is going

310
00:17:32,720 --> 00:17:36,240
to adverse the impact their
health, their quantity of life

311
00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:39,000
and the quantity of life for
their children, you could expect

312
00:17:39,000 --> 00:17:42,400
some resistance.
So in order to carry out their

313
00:17:42,400 --> 00:17:45,240
schemes, they need to be able to
ensure that you don't know about

314
00:17:45,240 --> 00:17:48,960
it, you know, so they have to be
able to control the narrative.

315
00:17:49,320 --> 00:17:51,320
They have to be able to load
people into a false sense of

316
00:17:51,320 --> 00:17:53,920
security.
And we're going to find nothing

317
00:17:53,920 --> 00:17:56,360
to worry about.
It's all OK here, here's the

318
00:17:56,360 --> 00:17:58,320
bread and here's the circus.
Go on.

319
00:17:58,320 --> 00:18:00,240
And then be entertained with
that, you know?

320
00:18:00,520 --> 00:18:04,480
But the shepherds who follow the
voice of truth or the spirit of

321
00:18:04,480 --> 00:18:07,360
truth, they recognize that
there's a danger to the flock,

322
00:18:07,520 --> 00:18:09,720
even if the flock aren't
conscious of it.

323
00:18:10,160 --> 00:18:12,280
And they're the ones who raise
the Alarum and say, look,

324
00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:15,480
there's, there's people are
making moves here.

325
00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:17,960
They're going to hurt you.
You know, they, they come to the

326
00:18:17,960 --> 00:18:23,120
people to warn them that there
is a conspiracy at play, if you

327
00:18:23,120 --> 00:18:27,760
will, uh, to, to undermine their
security and to, uh, transfer

328
00:18:27,760 --> 00:18:30,360
wealth from them.
You know, we saw just recently

329
00:18:30,360 --> 00:18:33,160
the most massive transfer of
wealth from the middle class

330
00:18:33,160 --> 00:18:38,640
into five hands in, in ever, you
know, uh, massive wealth

331
00:18:38,640 --> 00:18:42,400
transfer over the, the, the
last, I suppose you'd call it,

332
00:18:42,480 --> 00:18:44,080
but the pandemic is what it's
known as.

333
00:18:44,640 --> 00:18:46,160
So mothers called it a scam
demic.

334
00:18:48,040 --> 00:18:49,960
So that that was a massive
thing.

335
00:18:49,960 --> 00:18:52,120
Like, you know, people's rights
were restricted.

336
00:18:52,120 --> 00:18:57,440
They couldn't object, They
couldn't engage in any rational

337
00:18:57,440 --> 00:19:00,400
discussion about the matter, you
know, and their, their

338
00:19:00,400 --> 00:19:02,720
livelihoods were threatened.
There was intimidation, there

339
00:19:02,720 --> 00:19:07,160
was censorship.
There was like, the full weight

340
00:19:07,160 --> 00:19:11,040
of the, the the law was brought
to bear to destroy lives and

341
00:19:11,040 --> 00:19:13,560
careers, you know, if you had
any dissent.

342
00:19:13,560 --> 00:19:16,000
And now, years later, yeah,
turns out it was only a cold or

343
00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:17,120
a flu.
Yeah, sorry about that.

344
00:19:18,480 --> 00:19:21,640
It was pretty bad here too.
I mean, we still have people

345
00:19:21,640 --> 00:19:26,600
that are my wife is suffering
from, I'm talking specifically

346
00:19:26,600 --> 00:19:28,840
about the vaccines.
And I know a lot of people.

347
00:19:28,840 --> 00:19:32,040
I know people that lost their
lives and their doctors are not

348
00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:35,080
telling them the truth.
The way that you, you, you kind

349
00:19:35,080 --> 00:19:38,960
of phrase it is, is that there's
an attempt at a top down control

350
00:19:38,960 --> 00:19:43,600
of the market ideas and, and,
and, and you also bring up the

351
00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:47,280
fact that it's a lot of it has
communist tendencies.

352
00:19:47,640 --> 00:19:50,120
And we know that the Urantia
book actually has a couple of

353
00:19:50,120 --> 00:19:54,480
phrases where it says that
communism is not an ideal way of

354
00:19:54,600 --> 00:19:55,080
of.
Government.

355
00:19:55,840 --> 00:19:59,480
Yeah.
And So what is in you, in you

356
00:19:59,480 --> 00:20:01,520
and Ireland?
I mean, you, your leaders, I

357
00:20:01,520 --> 00:20:05,680
mean you can't talk about you've
got to affirm people's pronouns.

358
00:20:06,360 --> 00:20:08,760
You very.
Strict, but that's, that's

359
00:20:08,760 --> 00:20:10,920
government nonsense too, you
know, like if you're working,

360
00:20:10,920 --> 00:20:15,600
say in like the, in the health
system, you know, if you're

361
00:20:15,600 --> 00:20:17,840
working government bodies, only
government bodies can afford to

362
00:20:17,840 --> 00:20:22,240
do that sort of lunacy.
Like, you know, but like

363
00:20:22,240 --> 00:20:24,960
affirming pronouns, I don't know
how that helps anybody in

364
00:20:24,960 --> 00:20:26,800
anything.
You know, it's, it's just

365
00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:29,440
affirming people in their
delusions, you know, which is

366
00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:33,720
unfortunate because like I, I
grew up watching mental illness.

367
00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:36,600
I, my own mother had serious
mental health problems.

368
00:20:36,600 --> 00:20:39,480
She was in another psychiatric
hospital and I saw people who

369
00:20:39,480 --> 00:20:42,720
had serious psychiatric
disorders.

370
00:20:43,040 --> 00:20:46,640
And part of my desire for to
help people find help and

371
00:20:46,640 --> 00:20:49,160
happiness and wholeness, it
comes from the fact that I was

372
00:20:49,160 --> 00:20:51,640
so eager to try and help my
mother overcome depression.

373
00:20:52,240 --> 00:20:55,800
And for me, truth would set you
free.

374
00:20:55,800 --> 00:21:00,640
And truth can help you get out
of all sorts of mental funks if

375
00:21:00,640 --> 00:21:03,640
you can, if you have the courage
to, to face up to it, to to it,

376
00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:06,640
you know, and like, if you
antibiotic, it takes a lot of

377
00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:10,640
courage to face the truth.
Like, and the when I look at

378
00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:12,200
what's going on in the world
right now, there's a

379
00:21:12,200 --> 00:21:15,000
considerable psychic
disturbance.

380
00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:18,360
People are deeply happy and
deeply confused and for all

381
00:21:18,360 --> 00:21:21,320
kinds of reasons.
But affirming people in their

382
00:21:21,320 --> 00:21:25,600
delusions is not a part to
health and to happiness and to

383
00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:27,920
wholeness.
You know it, it never was.

384
00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:32,000
And, and when I see kind of this
top down approach to healthcare,

385
00:21:32,160 --> 00:21:37,360
which basically affirm them in
their delusions, like that's you

386
00:21:37,360 --> 00:21:39,200
can ask me to do that, but I
don't have to do that.

387
00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:42,440
I care about people and I talk
to them and I, I work with them

388
00:21:42,440 --> 00:21:45,560
where they're at and as best I
can to help them find a way, you

389
00:21:45,560 --> 00:21:48,480
know, like the idea of the
shepherd listening to the sheep

390
00:21:48,480 --> 00:21:51,400
to try and find out where
they're trapped so that you can

391
00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:55,320
help them get out of that place
and find their way back to the

392
00:21:55,320 --> 00:21:59,880
flock.
You know, so this idea that you

393
00:21:59,880 --> 00:22:02,400
have to affirm a pronoun, I
don't know that that that is

394
00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:04,320
helpful.
It might be in a short term

395
00:22:04,320 --> 00:22:09,440
thing, you know, both.
For a long term thing, it's not.

396
00:22:09,440 --> 00:22:11,240
It's not a solution to to
genuine.

397
00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:14,760
Well, it's a symbol.
To me it's, it's, it's like 2 +

398
00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:20,880
2 = 5 in, you know, 1984.
It's like, don't believe your

399
00:22:20,880 --> 00:22:23,080
own eyes, believe what the
government tells you.

400
00:22:23,080 --> 00:22:26,040
And that's what frightens me.
You know, you make a good point

401
00:22:26,040 --> 00:22:28,160
too.
Also Barry, about how Jesus

402
00:22:28,520 --> 00:22:32,440
dared to speak truth to power.
He was not afraid of speaking

403
00:22:32,440 --> 00:22:36,720
the light of truth, even though
he actually upset the Sanhedrin

404
00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:41,080
and the Sadducees and he upset
the authorities and I and it,

405
00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:46,080
and it really gets to that where
when you start to see the here

406
00:22:46,080 --> 00:22:48,360
in America, we have a real
problem.

407
00:22:48,560 --> 00:22:52,160
We have way too many secrets.
We have national security

408
00:22:52,160 --> 00:22:55,600
agencies that are doing things
that are very secretive.

409
00:22:55,880 --> 00:22:58,840
And when I start hearing that
from a country that's supposedly

410
00:22:58,840 --> 00:23:02,360
a moral beacon to the rest of
the world, I start to question

411
00:23:02,640 --> 00:23:04,880
what exactly are they doing in
our name?

412
00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:07,720
And, and, and why are they, why
are they doing this?

413
00:23:07,720 --> 00:23:11,600
It has to be driven by some
absolute desire for power.

414
00:23:11,600 --> 00:23:15,360
And that does not bode well.
I worry that the United States,

415
00:23:15,360 --> 00:23:20,600
having been given the initial
revelation, will do exactly what

416
00:23:20,600 --> 00:23:23,800
the Jewish religious leaders did
when Jesus came.

417
00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:26,360
Yes, that's where Jesus was
born.

418
00:23:26,360 --> 00:23:28,480
He was a Jew.
He was a trained Jew.

419
00:23:29,160 --> 00:23:32,280
But it was the Greeks that
carried the truth to the West,

420
00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:35,640
and it was not the Jews.
And they lost out on it.

421
00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:38,880
What could have been.
They could have been the the the

422
00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:43,320
carriers of the new revelation
of Christ and instead they were

423
00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:47,280
so caught up in their own
religious authority and again,

424
00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:50,080
that thirst for power over
people.

425
00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:54,040
It's just but it's curious to
know where this thing will end

426
00:23:54,040 --> 00:23:55,880
up.
Will there be a country?

427
00:23:56,440 --> 00:24:00,840
I often speculated perhaps 100
or maybe 200 years from now,

428
00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:05,360
China might be the spiritual
awakening there and they might

429
00:24:05,680 --> 00:24:09,560
somehow embrace the Urantia book
or or maybe it might be Africa

430
00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:11,480
or Nairobi or somewhere, you
know, Kenya.

431
00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:14,240
Hard to know where the
revelation?

432
00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:16,720
You ever think about that?
Where the revelation?

433
00:24:18,080 --> 00:24:21,080
I do.
I certainly do.

434
00:24:21,080 --> 00:24:23,480
Well, we do know that
eventually, eventually there

435
00:24:23,480 --> 00:24:26,560
will be the areas of light life,
you know, eventually the gospel

436
00:24:26,640 --> 00:24:29,920
will conquer the earth.
But it's a transition between

437
00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:32,520
here and there that's kind of
hard to see because right now we

438
00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:35,600
seem to be right in the thick.
Like, you know, where, you know,

439
00:24:35,600 --> 00:24:37,640
they say you enter a long ton of
where the light behind just

440
00:24:37,640 --> 00:24:39,720
disappeared and the light in
front of you hasn't appeared

441
00:24:39,720 --> 00:24:42,440
yet.
You know, and like here we are

442
00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:47,960
with this fantastic revelation
that nobody wants to and and

443
00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:49,480
like the world is going up from
flames.

444
00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:53,200
You're like, guys, could I just
just have a ditch for one minute

445
00:24:54,440 --> 00:25:00,200
just about to go in there And
you know, but we'll find a way,

446
00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:02,520
you know, we'll find a way.
There has to be a way to

447
00:25:02,520 --> 00:25:04,840
connect.
Like I write like crazy trying

448
00:25:04,840 --> 00:25:07,280
to find a way to articulate
these things that will appeal to

449
00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:12,120
people.
And sometimes it's hard, you

450
00:25:12,120 --> 00:25:15,200
know, because like, your anti
book gives you so much to work

451
00:25:15,200 --> 00:25:19,480
with, you know?
And it can be hard to find a way

452
00:25:19,480 --> 00:25:24,880
to speak in the common man's
tongue, you know?

453
00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:28,560
Well, if you stick see, I've
I've learned recently in the

454
00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:33,800
last year or two, I stopped
thinking of this as as a non

455
00:25:33,800 --> 00:25:39,760
Christian religion because the
Urantia book for there's not a

456
00:25:39,760 --> 00:25:42,600
Christian in the world that
could read the life and

457
00:25:42,600 --> 00:25:46,720
teachings of Jesus and not be
changed and not have a new

458
00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:49,560
appreciation of Christ.
This is impossible.

459
00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:53,120
I think if you have a sincere
love of Jesus and you read that

460
00:25:53,120 --> 00:25:55,760
book and you change your life,
if you have a sincere love, you

461
00:25:55,760 --> 00:25:57,800
know you're not a cultural
Christian like.

462
00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:01,440
Yeah, and that kind of gets me
to the point.

463
00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:04,840
Do you wonder why Europe has
gone so secular?

464
00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:08,760
What's up with that?
Well, I think a lot of it had to

465
00:26:08,760 --> 00:26:12,600
do with the fact that
Christianity was so second hand

466
00:26:12,600 --> 00:26:14,360
in nature.
You know, the the experience of

467
00:26:14,360 --> 00:26:18,560
the Gospel was primarily a
cultural, ritualistic and custom

468
00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:22,320
based thing as opposed to
spiritually engagement with the

469
00:26:22,400 --> 00:26:24,040
fundamental truths of the
Gospel.

470
00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:30,000
You know, and I think part of
that had to do with the church,

471
00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:34,400
the Catholic Church itself in
that it, they were so obsessed

472
00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:37,800
with ritual and obedience and
adherence.

473
00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:40,160
You know, it's kind of lost,
it's lost its way.

474
00:26:40,160 --> 00:26:42,520
And even the like there's
prophets within the church

475
00:26:42,520 --> 00:26:45,480
themselves that say, you know,
the church is about to entering

476
00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:49,840
into a phase of purging and
where it's going to be seriously

477
00:26:49,840 --> 00:26:53,680
put through the wringer because
it has wandered away from from

478
00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:56,360
the the gospel, you know, and it
can rediscover itself

479
00:26:56,360 --> 00:26:59,640
eventually.
But I think that's part of it.

480
00:26:59,640 --> 00:27:03,040
I think, say the this schism
with the the Protestant

481
00:27:03,040 --> 00:27:08,240
religions, it was important for
the spiritual evolution, but at

482
00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:11,160
the same time, it creates its
own problems from a spiritual

483
00:27:11,160 --> 00:27:16,080
point of view.
So I think that there was there

484
00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:20,080
was so few people that had such
a strong connection with the

485
00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:22,960
Lord.
And I think that a lot of people

486
00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:24,600
just were kind of ruling along
with it.

487
00:27:24,800 --> 00:27:28,400
You know, like, there was a
story told here about a kid who

488
00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:32,320
goes into a priest, comes to
visit and there's a kid in the

489
00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:35,000
house.
And they say, oh, Johnny at

490
00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:38,720
Father Jones is coming over.
And so be nice when he comes in,

491
00:27:38,720 --> 00:27:42,040
Sign in comes Father Jimmy, tell
me, what do you know about what

492
00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:44,640
religion?
I'll tell you, Father, stand up,

493
00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:48,640
sit down, stand up, sit down.
Give me money, you know, because

494
00:27:48,640 --> 00:27:50,640
in the Catholic Church, you
stand up.

495
00:27:50,640 --> 00:27:52,920
You need to stand up.
You need to give you money.

496
00:27:53,360 --> 00:27:56,080
You know, that's, that's that's
what's happening there.

497
00:27:56,200 --> 00:27:58,680
Yeah.
And I've been like, one of the

498
00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:02,200
things I've been trying to
develop is like a constant, a

499
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:05,560
constitution for a religious
movement where we

500
00:28:06,200 --> 00:28:09,400
recontextualize key rituals like
the communion and the

501
00:28:09,400 --> 00:28:14,040
confirmation and to look at what
we mean by things like

502
00:28:14,040 --> 00:28:18,120
ordination and how a community
could function, you know, so

503
00:28:18,120 --> 00:28:22,000
that we can, we can preserve
ritual because ritual and

504
00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:24,480
liturgy are important.
You know, they're, they're not,

505
00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:27,960
they're not a substitute for
God, but they are a way for a

506
00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:30,800
community to articulate things,
you know, and to celebrate

507
00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:34,320
things.
And religious liturgy is, is

508
00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:37,240
important for celebrating, you
know, the, the changing of the

509
00:28:37,240 --> 00:28:41,200
seasons and the the working of a
child into a community and

510
00:28:42,760 --> 00:28:45,760
setting up a landmarks of when
the child enters into the age of

511
00:28:45,760 --> 00:28:48,080
moral discernment, which is
communion, the age of seven or

512
00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:49,400
eight.
You know, we know it from your

513
00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:52,200
anti book that the spirit comes
that it's the child's first

514
00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:54,720
communion, their first communion
with God, their first communion

515
00:28:54,920 --> 00:28:57,720
with moral realities.
Their, their, their, their

516
00:28:57,720 --> 00:29:00,760
divine compass switches on and
they can tell right from wrong.

517
00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:03,200
You know, it's at that age that
they become more than you have

518
00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:06,960
to stand up in a court of law
and, uh, are able to tell the

519
00:29:06,960 --> 00:29:08,640
truth.
You know, you don't have the

520
00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:11,360
truth of a four year old.
You you need to Chinese to about

521
00:29:11,360 --> 00:29:14,840
7 to age moral discernment.
Then you've got your rituals for

522
00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:17,200
the initiation for the pre
adolescence stage and the

523
00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:19,320
adolescence stage.
And I think all those things are

524
00:29:19,320 --> 00:29:23,800
important to celebrate and the
life of the child and also the

525
00:29:23,800 --> 00:29:26,800
life of the community.
It's great to to bind people

526
00:29:26,800 --> 00:29:29,200
together.
And I think that your anti book

527
00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:32,160
offers us a way to to
recontextualize all that in an

528
00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:35,240
incredible way that could really
lift the community, you know,

529
00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:39,280
and and that's one of the things
that that I'm kind of fascinated

530
00:29:39,560 --> 00:29:42,560
by.
And like I'm interested in, in

531
00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:47,360
putting you into book teachings,
in kind of into conversation

532
00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:49,320
with fundamental issues of our
time.

533
00:29:49,320 --> 00:29:51,960
One of them being how do we
understand religion and

534
00:29:51,960 --> 00:29:55,360
postmodern age?
And what sort of kind of

535
00:29:55,360 --> 00:29:58,880
political, spiritual insights
can we glean from the book that

536
00:29:58,880 --> 00:30:02,920
could help us lives better today
and set up our institutions to

537
00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:05,720
make them more accountable to
become a man and more

538
00:30:05,720 --> 00:30:07,480
serviceable?
Like one of the things your anti

539
00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:11,240
book talks about when it comes
to democracy and stuff that is

540
00:30:11,240 --> 00:30:14,640
the education of public opinion.
In order for people to make a

541
00:30:14,640 --> 00:30:17,320
good choice when it comes to
voting, they need to have the

542
00:30:17,320 --> 00:30:18,920
best information available to
them.

543
00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:25,440
But our media are all confused
of people.

544
00:30:25,560 --> 00:30:29,720
You know, I never hear the thing
called Operation Mockingbird, a

545
00:30:29,880 --> 00:30:33,920
government initiative to ensure
that the only thing that was

546
00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:37,480
inside in the public mind was
nonsense, you know, so that way

547
00:30:37,480 --> 00:30:40,240
they, they wouldn't be in a
position to coordinate

548
00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:44,120
themselves well enough to take
effective action to advance

549
00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:48,400
their particular causes.
You know, and the uranium book

550
00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:51,560
is it, it says that, you know,
properly, you've got to educate

551
00:30:51,560 --> 00:30:55,640
public opinion that that gives
you a good, a good start towards

552
00:30:55,640 --> 00:30:56,880
heading off in the right
direction.

553
00:30:57,040 --> 00:30:59,000
But in order to do that, you
have to have control of the

554
00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:01,040
public square, which is one of
the things they talk about in

555
00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:04,160
the article.
You know, the, the public square

556
00:31:04,160 --> 00:31:07,680
is, is so important.
You know, the, and this I

557
00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:10,240
remember when I first read in
the uranium book about the, the,

558
00:31:10,400 --> 00:31:16,520
the public magic and private
magic and that overtime that led

559
00:31:16,520 --> 00:31:20,520
to, to prayer and to the, to the
social experience of prayer,

560
00:31:20,520 --> 00:31:22,800
where everybody got together and
recited a common prayer.

561
00:31:23,160 --> 00:31:26,520
And that there was things that
were acceptable in public that

562
00:31:26,520 --> 00:31:29,560
were not acceptable that that,
you know, there was things that

563
00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:31,560
you could do in public, but that
you couldn't do.

564
00:31:32,760 --> 00:31:37,560
I'm sorry, I'm confusing myself.
No, no, no, in private is the

565
00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:39,720
that you could get away with in
private that you can't do in

566
00:31:39,720 --> 00:31:41,240
public.
You know, and that had a

567
00:31:41,240 --> 00:31:44,040
sanitizing effect.
And we have a problem today

568
00:31:44,040 --> 00:31:47,120
because our the public square,
it's like our newspapers, our

569
00:31:47,120 --> 00:31:51,720
radios and our TV's, they've
been Co opted and people are not

570
00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:54,800
getting the radar that they're
supposed to get the to give the

571
00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:58,560
insight into the troubles that
are that are the real issues

572
00:31:58,560 --> 00:32:00,920
that are going to be affecting
their lives and exploring where

573
00:32:00,920 --> 00:32:04,920
the real solutions are.
So what's happening now is that

574
00:32:04,920 --> 00:32:08,480
you've got those kind of forward
thinking individuals who are

575
00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:11,960
going outside the mainstream
sources and trying to find

576
00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:15,600
reliable journalism online.
And the online journalism is

577
00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:19,520
becoming the new Market Square,
town square, you know, And The

578
00:32:19,520 --> 00:32:24,040
thing is, it's not happening
fast enough for us to get ahead

579
00:32:24,040 --> 00:32:27,800
of the problem, you know,
because we have an enormous

580
00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:34,000
sizeable portion of society is
still only sees the TV or only

581
00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:35,840
sees the radio or only sees the
newspaper.

582
00:32:35,840 --> 00:32:40,560
That's, that's their window on
the world, you know, and the,

583
00:32:40,560 --> 00:32:43,960
the, as a result of that, the
narratives are being constructed

584
00:32:43,960 --> 00:32:46,560
for them.
Their, their thoughts are being

585
00:32:46,560 --> 00:32:49,080
constructed for them.
And again, this brings us back

586
00:32:49,080 --> 00:32:52,000
to the purpose of education.
Like the purpose of education

587
00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:55,200
should be not to teach you what
to think, but how to think, how

588
00:32:55,200 --> 00:32:57,560
to critically analyse and
evaluate situations.

589
00:32:57,880 --> 00:33:01,080
And with the progressive dumbing
down of the education system, we

590
00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:03,720
see how people struggle with
this idea of independent free

591
00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:06,040
thought.
And it was especially clear with

592
00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:08,480
the pandemic.
That's the thing that astounded

593
00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:13,240
me most about it was the
inability to think rationally,

594
00:33:13,520 --> 00:33:16,960
you know, the inability to sit
down and consider a proposition

595
00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:18,600
and kind of work your way
through it.

596
00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:21,200
Like I had often, like I've been
workshops with people.

597
00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:23,920
And one of the things I said
that we are emotional beings

598
00:33:23,920 --> 00:33:26,120
long, long, long before we're
ever rational beings.

599
00:33:26,400 --> 00:33:29,360
And most people never even
achieve true rational

600
00:33:29,680 --> 00:33:32,040
rationality.
You know, they, they, they're,

601
00:33:32,040 --> 00:33:34,080
they're, they're, they're
thinking of that.

602
00:33:34,080 --> 00:33:36,600
Your anti book says that the
next age of men will involve a

603
00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:38,560
quality of thinking.
You know what I'm saying?

604
00:33:38,560 --> 00:33:41,520
First it was a just a bare
survival.

605
00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:44,000
Once you've established
survival, then it's for a

606
00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:45,840
quality of living.
And once you have a quality of

607
00:33:45,840 --> 00:33:48,240
living sorted out, the next
thing would be a quality of

608
00:33:48,240 --> 00:33:51,040
thinking.
And the pandemic taught us that

609
00:33:51,040 --> 00:33:53,880
there is widespread poor thick
quality thinking.

610
00:33:54,120 --> 00:33:58,400
We need to be able to up our
game from a, from a, a cognitive

611
00:33:58,400 --> 00:34:01,200
performance point of view where
we're actually capable of

612
00:34:01,200 --> 00:34:04,480
independent thought and we're
not governed by fear, you know,

613
00:34:04,720 --> 00:34:06,480
and I think this is one of the
great things with religion.

614
00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:08,360
Religion allows us to banish
fear.

615
00:34:08,560 --> 00:34:11,400
And that's what makes us kind of
courageous thinkers.

616
00:34:11,400 --> 00:34:14,199
Then, you know it.
We know that we can, we can face

617
00:34:14,199 --> 00:34:17,360
the thing that we fear and we
might be defeated, but we could

618
00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:19,440
very well over cost, you know,
especially with faith.

619
00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:23,639
And we can create a better world
that way, you know, So we're

620
00:34:23,639 --> 00:34:26,800
finding all these huge
challenges landing upon our door

621
00:34:26,800 --> 00:34:30,280
like, you know, like the like we
have to have a set up better

622
00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:32,679
control of the public squares so
the people can have access to

623
00:34:32,679 --> 00:34:35,639
the right information.
We need to have good education

624
00:34:35,639 --> 00:34:39,040
so people can learn how to
think, you know, how to be

625
00:34:39,040 --> 00:34:43,880
critically engaged and not allow
the feelings to govern them, you

626
00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:47,760
know, at least at least not the
negative feelings, you know, I

627
00:34:47,760 --> 00:34:49,199
mean positive feelings.
Fair enough.

628
00:34:49,199 --> 00:34:54,560
Like, but yeah, so there's a lot
of that sort of stuff that's

629
00:34:54,560 --> 00:34:58,240
kind of subliminally involved in
the the article that I've put

630
00:34:58,240 --> 00:35:00,920
together, you know?
Yeah, I want to tell people,

631
00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:04,440
just let me read this one part.
And this has to do with hate

632
00:35:04,440 --> 00:35:09,520
speech and the reasons you know
why we're against it, You write.

633
00:35:09,560 --> 00:35:13,040
Isn't it peculiar that the
Communists want to silence the

634
00:35:13,040 --> 00:35:17,320
followers of Christ, imprison,
torture and destroy the lives of

635
00:35:17,320 --> 00:35:20,160
those who would dare to
highlight the practices of the

636
00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:22,760
corrupt and exalt the world to
righteousness?

637
00:35:23,040 --> 00:35:25,480
Jesus felt no need to control
the narrative.

638
00:35:25,760 --> 00:35:28,720
He knew the truth could not be
extinguished by lies and

639
00:35:28,720 --> 00:35:31,440
deception.
No more than greater.

640
00:35:32,120 --> 00:35:34,840
Greater than the.
The lesser can be destroyed by

641
00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:38,920
the no more than the greater can
be destroyed by the lesser.

642
00:35:39,200 --> 00:35:42,840
The substance undone by its own
shadow.

643
00:35:43,080 --> 00:35:45,560
I thought that was very
profound, what you said there.

644
00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:47,480
And it and it plays to what
you're talking.

645
00:35:48,240 --> 00:35:52,360
The truth shall set you free.
And the opposite is when the

646
00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:55,440
truth is hidden, then you are
not free.

647
00:35:56,280 --> 00:35:59,320
You become enslaved.
Yes, you become enslaved by what

648
00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:03,040
they whatever that narrative is.
And we learned a great lesson

649
00:36:03,040 --> 00:36:06,680
during COVID and I think you and
I will find a lot of agreement.

650
00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:13,000
I was astounded at how easily
people would just comply with

651
00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:17,160
what wearing masks outside, you
know, on a hot sunny day.

652
00:36:17,160 --> 00:36:20,280
And people, I remember what I
was with my in laws and we were

653
00:36:20,280 --> 00:36:23,400
walking along the beach in sunny
South Florida.

654
00:36:23,400 --> 00:36:26,560
It was the middle of August.
It was hot and they're wearing

655
00:36:26,560 --> 00:36:31,360
their masks.
I thought, you know, I, I didn't

656
00:36:31,360 --> 00:36:34,760
want to say anything, but I felt
like if you're really following

657
00:36:34,760 --> 00:36:38,000
the science, do you think that
there's a COVID virus floating

658
00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:41,400
around out here somewhere that
is just waiting to get inside of

659
00:36:41,400 --> 00:36:44,160
you or somebody's?
Going to come up and actually.

660
00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:46,320
Sneeze on you or something.
You know some.

661
00:36:47,240 --> 00:36:49,320
But it's the world that
ultimately led me to a thing

662
00:36:49,320 --> 00:36:54,440
called the the no virus
scenario, which I think it was

663
00:36:54,440 --> 00:36:56,480
one of the most significant
things that I kind of came

664
00:36:56,480 --> 00:37:01,240
across all of the whole thing.
And the people would be too.

665
00:37:01,240 --> 00:37:02,960
Better to look it up.
It's interesting stuff, you

666
00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:03,560
know?
Yeah.

667
00:37:03,720 --> 00:37:05,920
Like, there's an awful lot of
scientists who were cut off the

668
00:37:05,920 --> 00:37:07,800
air and had their careers
destroyed, you know?

669
00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:10,200
Yeah.
I remember a wonderful lady

670
00:37:10,200 --> 00:37:12,480
doctor.
She used to she was an Icelandic

671
00:37:12,480 --> 00:37:14,520
woman.
We had the start of the pandemic

672
00:37:14,520 --> 00:37:17,240
and she she was on the Radio One
day and she just kind of well,

673
00:37:17,360 --> 00:37:20,040
you know, that don't really tell
me how we ever did it.

674
00:37:20,440 --> 00:37:23,760
Do we not think that this is
silly that and she just she just

675
00:37:23,760 --> 00:37:26,000
wasn't even a scathing criticism
was like, you know, well,

676
00:37:26,200 --> 00:37:28,960
standard medicine is this is how
you put such a thing to do do

677
00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:32,520
this.
They ruined her life and then

678
00:37:32,520 --> 00:37:34,680
forget that reasonable.
They ruined her life.

679
00:37:34,680 --> 00:37:37,920
I think, Oh my God, you evil,
evil creatures, like, how would

680
00:37:37,920 --> 00:37:39,800
you do that?
And the woman was like a like a

681
00:37:39,800 --> 00:37:43,520
great doctor surgeon.
She did her time in India and

682
00:37:43,520 --> 00:37:45,400
stuff like that.
You know, she used to work with

683
00:37:45,400 --> 00:37:47,880
kids that had a, what they call
a hair lip.

684
00:37:48,560 --> 00:37:50,760
And so it's like in India at
least have a difficult time.

685
00:37:50,760 --> 00:37:53,880
We're trying to get the
competent surgeons to, to, to

686
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:55,360
surgically manage things like
that.

687
00:37:55,640 --> 00:37:58,200
But so she, she got her
experience over there, I think,

688
00:37:58,640 --> 00:38:01,800
and she came back and she looked
and talked on the radio and the

689
00:38:01,800 --> 00:38:03,880
government went to town and it
was just amazing.

690
00:38:03,920 --> 00:38:06,720
Like, but again, it's, it's
usually, it's the spectacle.

691
00:38:06,840 --> 00:38:10,080
Make an absolute sure this one
person and that'll make

692
00:38:10,080 --> 00:38:14,240
everybody else shut up.
I hope it doesn't get worse, but

693
00:38:14,520 --> 00:38:19,840
something tells me it may just
get worse and, and who knows who

694
00:38:19,840 --> 00:38:24,080
knows when that when we'll wake
up collectively and start to

695
00:38:24,080 --> 00:38:28,640
realize that a small group of
people really trying to gain a

696
00:38:28,640 --> 00:38:30,400
lot of power.
That's what I think is behind

697
00:38:30,400 --> 00:38:32,040
it.
And who knows whether Kalagasti

698
00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:35,480
is behind it or, you know,
whether the forces of Lucifer

699
00:38:35,480 --> 00:38:38,880
still at play even though he's,
you know, on a detention world?

700
00:38:39,320 --> 00:38:41,160
Let me ask you.
But we don't true that a small

701
00:38:41,160 --> 00:38:44,000
group of people can make a great
difference, can make a positive

702
00:38:44,000 --> 00:38:46,720
difference. 12 little fishermen,
11 fishermen.

703
00:38:46,720 --> 00:38:48,560
No.
Well, let's say to Jesus, 12

704
00:38:48,560 --> 00:38:51,800
fishermen in Galilee 2000 years
ago set out to turn the world

705
00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:54,360
upside down.
You know, they succeeded.

706
00:38:54,400 --> 00:38:55,760
Yeah.
You know, they succeeded.

707
00:38:55,760 --> 00:39:00,360
So against the odds.
And it's miraculous and

708
00:39:00,520 --> 00:39:02,320
profound.
And God's grace was involved

709
00:39:02,320 --> 00:39:04,280
throughout, no doubt.
Like, you know, sorry, I

710
00:39:04,280 --> 00:39:05,320
interrupted.
You were going to say you're

711
00:39:05,320 --> 00:39:07,760
going to ask me something?
I just want to ask you because

712
00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:10,600
we I know that it's getting late
where you're at and I try.

713
00:39:10,600 --> 00:39:12,640
To keep these things all evening
if you want.

714
00:39:13,120 --> 00:39:17,360
Well, tell me some of the what
is the most of all?

715
00:39:17,360 --> 00:39:20,440
There's four sections of the
Urantia book, so let's go with

716
00:39:20,440 --> 00:39:24,640
each one in the in the in the in
the first part of the book, what

717
00:39:24,640 --> 00:39:28,080
do you find most profound?
What moves you the most about

718
00:39:28,080 --> 00:39:31,120
the first section about the
central universe and about the

719
00:39:31,120 --> 00:39:34,640
father and and the family, the
first family of God, the Hovo

720
00:39:34,640 --> 00:39:37,480
and what what really speaks to
you in that section?

721
00:39:37,480 --> 00:39:40,400
I'd be curious to.
Know there's a team that runs

722
00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:43,320
through the whole book from the
beginning to the end and it

723
00:39:43,320 --> 00:39:47,440
occurs I think in the third
paragraph of the first page of

724
00:39:47,480 --> 00:39:53,280
the 1st paper and and it is BU
perfect even as your father in

725
00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:56,960
paradise is perfect.
And I did AI did a a lecture

726
00:39:56,960 --> 00:40:00,000
during pandemic and becoming God
like it's on YouTube.

727
00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:02,720
UAII think they did one of those
Urania Tom things or something.

728
00:40:03,480 --> 00:40:09,280
And I did a lecture on that.
And that has been throughout the

729
00:40:09,280 --> 00:40:13,040
whole book, from the beginning,
from the first papers, all the

730
00:40:13,040 --> 00:40:18,400
way down, you know.
Yeah, I found that fascinating.

731
00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:21,800
For me, it was, it was
practically the opening note of

732
00:40:21,800 --> 00:40:24,440
the book, like, you know, and
then we see the life of Jesus,

733
00:40:24,440 --> 00:40:26,360
the perfected life.
There you go.

734
00:40:26,360 --> 00:40:28,800
That's the end of it.
Like, you know, this is the IT

735
00:40:28,800 --> 00:40:31,960
goes forward from, from paradise
and then it comes out in time

736
00:40:31,960 --> 00:40:35,560
and it reaches its Senate in the
life of something like Jesus,

737
00:40:35,560 --> 00:40:39,840
you know, or maybe the other of
ones or whatever.

738
00:40:41,040 --> 00:40:43,240
That is perfect, Yeah, because
you're right.

739
00:40:43,240 --> 00:40:47,320
Everything stems from that.
That's the mission, the mission.

740
00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:49,840
And that's also the character of
the universe.

741
00:40:49,840 --> 00:40:54,680
Every from the living cell.
I tell you just I'd never dawned

742
00:40:54,680 --> 00:40:59,000
on me the the miracle of when
you injure yourself and your

743
00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:03,600
cells know exactly what to do to
heal that.

744
00:41:03,720 --> 00:41:07,920
That is the same BU perfect even
as I am perfect.

745
00:41:07,920 --> 00:41:12,080
It is it is the character of the
living universe for things to

746
00:41:12,080 --> 00:41:16,560
seek perfection, whether it's
seeking a better life or trying

747
00:41:16,560 --> 00:41:19,720
to invent the air conditioner so
you're not hot all the time.

748
00:41:20,240 --> 00:41:23,920
It's it's whatever it is, but
it's it's there and it's a force

749
00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:26,440
it.
Is it is a force like I've I've

750
00:41:26,440 --> 00:41:28,880
written about that too.
I call it the will to perfection

751
00:41:29,400 --> 00:41:32,840
and the the will to perfection
as far as I concerned, is an

752
00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:36,600
actual for real force in the
universe and in the lives of

753
00:41:36,600 --> 00:41:40,120
every living being down to the
cell, down to the individual

754
00:41:40,120 --> 00:41:41,600
cell.
Even your anti book says that

755
00:41:41,800 --> 00:41:44,400
that business active down to the
individual cell.

756
00:41:44,680 --> 00:41:48,040
Everything aspires to to be
perfect and to be the best

757
00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:50,600
version of it, such as it can,
but only when you get set to the

758
00:41:50,600 --> 00:41:53,080
human stage.
It becomes a voluntary thing.

759
00:41:53,480 --> 00:41:55,400
You know, you have to choose to
do it.

760
00:41:55,560 --> 00:42:00,120
It doesn't just happen
automatically, you know, but,

761
00:42:00,240 --> 00:42:02,840
but like you, when you see the,
the way the, the universes

762
00:42:02,840 --> 00:42:06,680
themselves kind of find their,
they, they tend towards

763
00:42:06,720 --> 00:42:09,080
equilibrium, towards stability.
That's what they're after.

764
00:42:09,080 --> 00:42:11,880
They're, they're, they're,
they're slightly off center, but

765
00:42:11,880 --> 00:42:14,400
they're always pulling together
to try and find the, the, the

766
00:42:14,400 --> 00:42:18,040
point of stability and harmony.
And that's at work in our own

767
00:42:18,040 --> 00:42:19,680
minds.
Like, you know, we're slightly

768
00:42:19,680 --> 00:42:22,320
off center, but we're trying to
establish ourselves to, to, to

769
00:42:22,320 --> 00:42:25,160
find who we truly and
fundamentally and most perfectly

770
00:42:25,160 --> 00:42:27,280
are, you know, the best version
of ourselves.

771
00:42:27,640 --> 00:42:30,240
And then because that's the one
that can handle the stresses the

772
00:42:30,240 --> 00:42:33,040
best, you know, that's that your
optimally existence.

773
00:42:33,560 --> 00:42:38,640
And but throughout the the like,
it's hard to know where you

774
00:42:38,640 --> 00:42:41,080
could begin with how many
wonderful things are like, you

775
00:42:41,080 --> 00:42:43,560
know, from the first papers into
the second.

776
00:42:43,560 --> 00:42:49,000
Like I've spent a lot of time
focusing on the Jesus papers,

777
00:42:49,120 --> 00:42:50,560
you know, as the years have gone
by.

778
00:42:50,560 --> 00:42:53,040
You know, I can't every once in
a while.

779
00:42:53,040 --> 00:42:55,760
Then I go into the kind of the
anthropology books because

780
00:42:55,760 --> 00:42:57,560
they're they're great fun.
A lot of them.

781
00:42:57,560 --> 00:42:59,120
You know, I love some of the
stuff to say.

782
00:42:59,120 --> 00:43:01,440
They're so funny.
There's there's great weight in

783
00:43:01,440 --> 00:43:03,440
your anti book.
Like I have to say, you know, we

784
00:43:03,440 --> 00:43:06,800
we laugh and sometimes when you
think about the stuff to say,

785
00:43:06,800 --> 00:43:09,160
like, you know, the the stuff to
say about marriage and about

786
00:43:09,160 --> 00:43:12,760
marriage more, it's very funny
and addicted.

787
00:43:12,960 --> 00:43:15,520
You remember the one where they
had a there was a particular

788
00:43:15,520 --> 00:43:19,480
tribe and they would always
marry an order person after a

789
00:43:19,480 --> 00:43:21,680
younger person.
And then when the younger,

790
00:43:21,840 --> 00:43:23,560
younger person, as they got
older, the older person would

791
00:43:23,560 --> 00:43:25,920
die and then they would be in a
position to marry a younger

792
00:43:25,920 --> 00:43:28,400
person.
And they used to do that because

793
00:43:28,400 --> 00:43:30,520
so that there wouldn't be two
fools in the marriage.

794
00:43:35,560 --> 00:43:37,800
I thought this was brilliant.
Oh my God.

795
00:43:38,080 --> 00:43:39,560
And there's so many things like
that.

796
00:43:39,560 --> 00:43:41,760
You know, they're talking about
the like, nobody knew how they

797
00:43:41,760 --> 00:43:44,840
got pregnant.
They didn't connect sex with,

798
00:43:44,840 --> 00:43:48,120
with their pregnancy.
So the women thought that they

799
00:43:48,120 --> 00:43:51,720
would, could, could get pregnant
by bathing in shallow water.

800
00:43:52,080 --> 00:43:54,480
So they were more obsessed about
not bathing that about having

801
00:43:54,480 --> 00:43:55,680
sex.
Like, I wonder how am I still

802
00:43:55,680 --> 00:43:59,360
getting pregnant?
You know, there's all that sort

803
00:43:59,360 --> 00:44:01,080
of stuff.
You're like, God, that's, that's

804
00:44:01,120 --> 00:44:04,840
just just so funny.
It's great fun, you know, so

805
00:44:04,840 --> 00:44:07,200
there's just things like that.
And like one of the most

806
00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:10,960
fantastic elements I thought was
the the, the ghost cult and

807
00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:12,360
shamanism and all that kind of
stuff.

808
00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:14,840
You know, you said the shamans
are very expensive that were

809
00:44:14,840 --> 00:44:18,160
worth every penny.
And they talk about the how, how

810
00:44:18,240 --> 00:44:22,280
they went from ghost fear into
this idea of like, you know,

811
00:44:22,280 --> 00:44:24,880
being persecuted by the ghost
for all the things they didn't

812
00:44:24,880 --> 00:44:27,640
do to ultimately realizing the
idea that there was good and

813
00:44:27,640 --> 00:44:30,920
even spirits and that ultimately
their behavior solicited

814
00:44:30,920 --> 00:44:33,040
responses from the spirits in a
particular way.

815
00:44:33,320 --> 00:44:36,480
And that eventually gave to the
idea obscene and the the idea

816
00:44:36,480 --> 00:44:41,840
that God was stable, reliable
and moral, you know, that that

817
00:44:42,080 --> 00:44:46,040
and one of the things said that
man couldn't envision a change

818
00:44:46,040 --> 00:44:49,720
this God until he himself had
acquired some level of stability

819
00:44:49,720 --> 00:44:53,200
of character, you know, until he
wasn't a capricious, vicious

820
00:44:53,200 --> 00:44:56,440
soul.
You know, they had to to develop

821
00:44:56,440 --> 00:45:00,000
some level of moral code and
appreciation of of kindness and

822
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:03,040
of mercy before they could
actually envision a God that

823
00:45:03,040 --> 00:45:04,480
could have some kindness and
mercy in it.

824
00:45:04,480 --> 00:45:08,000
Like, you know, and do that
whole kind of anthropological

825
00:45:08,000 --> 00:45:10,320
study like you, even when it the
way it looks at the history of

826
00:45:10,320 --> 00:45:13,640
war, those papers is brilliant.
It's fascinating.

827
00:45:13,640 --> 00:45:15,920
It's so much of interest to be
learned.

828
00:45:16,200 --> 00:45:19,800
Like I took a section from, I
think of the paper 71 where the

829
00:45:19,800 --> 00:45:26,600
talk about the life on a
neighbouring planet and there's

830
00:45:26,600 --> 00:45:28,640
this continent, which is
basically, it's almost like the

831
00:45:28,640 --> 00:45:30,760
America of the continent of the
planet.

832
00:45:30,760 --> 00:45:33,640
You know, it's way ahead of
everybody in the standard of

833
00:45:33,640 --> 00:45:35,440
living and technology and all
that kind of stuff.

834
00:45:35,720 --> 00:45:40,600
But one of the things about it
is that it it doesn't abuse this

835
00:45:40,600 --> 00:45:45,560
war machine to as an aggressive,
as an aggressor, you know, what

836
00:45:45,560 --> 00:45:47,240
was that in a different article?
Actually, I don't think I

837
00:45:47,240 --> 00:45:49,040
mentioned that Nissan, you're
right.

838
00:45:49,040 --> 00:45:51,960
I didn't actually, but I was
just writing about that recently

839
00:45:51,960 --> 00:45:56,800
and in that paper to talk about
how they they wouldn't they

840
00:45:56,920 --> 00:46:00,880
always act in defense, but never
in in, in aggressively.

841
00:46:00,880 --> 00:46:03,640
Like, you know, and I felt to
myself when I often look at

842
00:46:03,640 --> 00:46:06,240
what's happening with the
American expansionism around the

843
00:46:06,240 --> 00:46:09,200
world, I think, oh man, you've
kind of you've got this

844
00:46:09,200 --> 00:46:11,560
spiritual test nowhere.
You've got all this power and

845
00:46:11,560 --> 00:46:14,280
you're abusing it.
And that's going to spell a

846
00:46:14,280 --> 00:46:16,960
problem for you in the future.
You know, because you read as

847
00:46:16,960 --> 00:46:19,520
you saw, you know, you read the,
you saw the wind and you read

848
00:46:19,520 --> 00:46:22,680
the wind.
And I think that's, that's a

849
00:46:22,680 --> 00:46:24,880
problem for America.
And it's going to, it's probably

850
00:46:24,880 --> 00:46:27,880
no more than the Jews losing
their crown that the Americans

851
00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:31,520
might well lose their crown, you
know, as a result of of their

852
00:46:31,520 --> 00:46:33,960
spiritual folly.
Well, and we're going to pay the

853
00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:37,520
price for that too, because what
what follows after that is a lot

854
00:46:37,520 --> 00:46:41,720
of decay.
And I, I find it, I wonder the

855
00:46:41,720 --> 00:46:47,440
future of Europe, will it just
be an Islamic stronghold?

856
00:46:47,640 --> 00:46:51,240
Will eventually the the Anglo
Saxons, Will they be?

857
00:46:51,400 --> 00:46:54,360
It's hard to know.
But if they don't have faith and

858
00:46:54,360 --> 00:46:57,280
they don't have a good, clear
understanding of godly

859
00:46:57,280 --> 00:47:00,120
principles, they're easily going
to succumb, I think.

860
00:47:00,280 --> 00:47:02,520
But you know that your anti
book, it talks about that.

861
00:47:02,520 --> 00:47:05,240
It does say that.
I won't say it did speak One

862
00:47:05,240 --> 00:47:07,320
phase of the Kingdom in the
future have to do with the

863
00:47:07,360 --> 00:47:11,800
planetary crisis and I think
that we are at the door of that

864
00:47:11,800 --> 00:47:19,160
crisis now were experiencing
multiple critical factors were

865
00:47:19,160 --> 00:47:24,120
being overwhelmed with foreign
bodies that the borders have

866
00:47:24,120 --> 00:47:26,560
been have been broken down and
people are coming in from every

867
00:47:26,560 --> 00:47:30,480
corner of the planet and they're
unravelling social cohesion.

868
00:47:31,480 --> 00:47:35,240
That's that's a massive thing.
Another thing is the the undoing

869
00:47:35,240 --> 00:47:38,760
of our traditional values.
See, people, because people were

870
00:47:38,760 --> 00:47:42,560
so ambivalent to their religion,
they let go, they got really get

871
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:44,360
loose.
You know, they didn't realize

872
00:47:44,360 --> 00:47:48,360
how strong it was to hold the
nation together and to provide

873
00:47:48,360 --> 00:47:52,160
it with a bit of backbone.
And like, it's it's no

874
00:47:52,160 --> 00:47:56,800
coincidence that as religion has
decreased in terms of its hold

875
00:47:56,800 --> 00:48:00,480
in society and civilization,
hedonism and insanity has

876
00:48:00,480 --> 00:48:02,720
increased.
You know, there's more problems

877
00:48:02,720 --> 00:48:04,800
with drugs now than ever before,
more problems with broken

878
00:48:04,800 --> 00:48:07,880
marriages, broken homosexual
abuse, human trafficking.

879
00:48:07,880 --> 00:48:10,760
Oh my God, don't get me started.
You know, all these terrible,

880
00:48:10,760 --> 00:48:14,120
terrible things out there.
And like I was writing in a

881
00:48:14,120 --> 00:48:17,200
thing that recently, like, you
know, that that that corrupt men

882
00:48:17,200 --> 00:48:20,000
kind of prosper in a pro moral
and pro righteous culture.

883
00:48:20,520 --> 00:48:23,320
And as a result, in order to
kind of get ahead and have to

884
00:48:23,320 --> 00:48:27,040
undermine the, the sources of
morality and the, the

885
00:48:27,160 --> 00:48:30,440
institutions that promote
righteousness, you know, so, so

886
00:48:30,440 --> 00:48:32,360
that they can prosper with their
plans.

887
00:48:32,760 --> 00:48:36,320
And it seems to me that we are
at a turning point in terms of

888
00:48:36,320 --> 00:48:39,160
our religious awakening now,
because we have to realize that

889
00:48:40,040 --> 00:48:43,080
we were asleep at the we
religiously, you know, and as a

890
00:48:43,080 --> 00:48:45,080
result of that, we've been
surrounded and all sides known

891
00:48:45,080 --> 00:48:46,640
by enemies.
And that's going to be a

892
00:48:46,640 --> 00:48:48,160
problem.
And it's going to be a problem

893
00:48:48,160 --> 00:48:49,840
for us, and it's going to be a
problem for our children.

894
00:48:50,360 --> 00:48:52,880
I'll tell you this, though,
Barry, there are more articles

895
00:48:52,880 --> 00:48:56,200
being written now.
I just read one this morning and

896
00:48:56,200 --> 00:48:59,560
I read maybe one or two a week.
And you'll, you know, you'll,

897
00:48:59,560 --> 00:49:01,640
you'll see them.
They're not, you know, on the

898
00:49:01,640 --> 00:49:04,160
New York Times or anything like
that, or, or, you know, the

899
00:49:04,160 --> 00:49:06,160
London Times.
But people are starting to

900
00:49:06,160 --> 00:49:08,880
recognize that without
Christianity, without the basic

901
00:49:08,880 --> 00:49:13,600
tenets of Christian religious
principles, the society is going

902
00:49:13,600 --> 00:49:16,040
to fall.
And I think some of the smarter

903
00:49:16,040 --> 00:49:18,800
people in our country are
starting to ring the bell.

904
00:49:19,720 --> 00:49:21,840
Oh.
Yeah, I mean, even Dawkins has

905
00:49:21,840 --> 00:49:24,760
been like, well, I'm a cultural
Christian, you know, it's like,

906
00:49:24,760 --> 00:49:28,520
you know, I've been tearing.
He's been tailoring Christianity

907
00:49:28,520 --> 00:49:30,320
for decades.
And now suddenly like

908
00:49:30,320 --> 00:49:33,200
Christianity and back foot and
Islam starts to spring up left

909
00:49:33,200 --> 00:49:36,360
and right.
And he's like, well, well, I I

910
00:49:36,360 --> 00:49:40,720
don't want to replace with that.
When you helped with that man,

911
00:49:40,760 --> 00:49:42,680
you helped with the undoing of
this thing.

912
00:49:42,680 --> 00:49:45,040
You destroy the foundations of
the thing.

913
00:49:45,520 --> 00:49:47,920
But I suppose at the end of the
day, too, you can't blame him.

914
00:49:47,920 --> 00:49:52,920
Like he was like people didn't
have the have have real faith,

915
00:49:53,200 --> 00:49:55,840
you know, they didn't have a
proper connection to their guard

916
00:49:55,840 --> 00:49:58,440
and they wondered and got lost
and they're now they're in the

917
00:49:58,440 --> 00:50:00,880
dark woods now, you know, and
they're surrounded by wolves.

918
00:50:02,680 --> 00:50:05,400
But I think it's going to, it's
going to create like a critical

919
00:50:05,400 --> 00:50:08,600
spiritual reaction there because
if it doesn't, will be

920
00:50:08,600 --> 00:50:10,800
exterminated.
Yeah, you know.

921
00:50:11,600 --> 00:50:14,640
There's no two ways about.
It and, and you know, I, I think

922
00:50:14,640 --> 00:50:18,320
it's important for us to say
that as you're, I'll speak for

923
00:50:18,320 --> 00:50:21,280
me, not maybe for you, but it's
not that I have anything

924
00:50:21,280 --> 00:50:25,920
personal against Islam at all.
I have issues with the way that

925
00:50:25,920 --> 00:50:29,720
they subjugate their women.
I have, I, I know from the

926
00:50:29,720 --> 00:50:33,320
Urantia book, it teaches us that
it talks a little bit about the

927
00:50:33,320 --> 00:50:35,440
Blackstone.
What does it mention about the

928
00:50:35,440 --> 00:50:37,640
proclivity of that particular
tribe?

929
00:50:37,640 --> 00:50:42,240
And it was the earlier tribes of
Saudi Arabia and they had a one

930
00:50:42,240 --> 00:50:44,680
thing that united them was the
Kabbalah stone.

931
00:50:44,920 --> 00:50:49,000
You know, isn't that fascinating
that they bring the but, and I

932
00:50:49,000 --> 00:50:52,520
know people who are of the
Islamic faith who say it's a

933
00:50:52,680 --> 00:50:56,560
it's a religion of peace.
There are elements of submitting

934
00:50:56,560 --> 00:51:00,640
your will to Allah that I can
respect for people.

935
00:51:01,160 --> 00:51:03,720
What I don't like is that if
you're not just the same.

936
00:51:03,720 --> 00:51:06,600
I have a problem with Christians
who think that if you don't

937
00:51:06,600 --> 00:51:10,160
believe exactly as the Bible
teaches and somehow you're not

938
00:51:10,160 --> 00:51:12,640
really a Christian and you're
you're you're a Pagan.

939
00:51:13,000 --> 00:51:16,240
It's the same problem that the
Muslims have if you're not

940
00:51:16,240 --> 00:51:18,440
Islamic.
The Christians are not just some

941
00:51:18,440 --> 00:51:20,880
Christians are murderers, some
Christians are rapists.

942
00:51:21,200 --> 00:51:24,600
You know, that doesn't mean that
all Christianity is bad and you

943
00:51:24,600 --> 00:51:29,080
can say the same for Islam.
Just because some Islamics want

944
00:51:29,080 --> 00:51:32,280
to kill all Christians and all
Jews doesn't mean they all want

945
00:51:32,280 --> 00:51:34,800
to do that, you know, And I know
that for the fact I see it every

946
00:51:34,800 --> 00:51:40,040
day that I read there are
Muslims that that are pro

947
00:51:40,120 --> 00:51:43,600
Israel, you know, I mean genuine
Arabs that are pro Israel, like,

948
00:51:43,600 --> 00:51:45,440
you know, so it's not every one
of them.

949
00:51:45,840 --> 00:51:48,760
Absolutely not.
You know, there's a soul in

950
00:51:48,760 --> 00:51:51,000
there right in the Middle East
is a is a really big problem

951
00:51:51,000 --> 00:51:53,840
there, you know, so.
They're all searching for God.

952
00:51:53,840 --> 00:51:56,040
I mean, that's the, The thing is
we all have God in it.

953
00:51:56,040 --> 00:51:59,240
So we also have, we have erring
brothers and sisters, as they

954
00:51:59,240 --> 00:52:03,120
say.
Well, listen, I, I am just so

955
00:52:03,120 --> 00:52:05,360
thrilled that we had the time to
spend together.

956
00:52:05,880 --> 00:52:11,520
I I the final thought here is
what do you what do you think is

957
00:52:11,520 --> 00:52:14,440
the most important thing for
people to know about the Urantia

958
00:52:14,440 --> 00:52:16,280
book?
For people who may have never

959
00:52:16,280 --> 00:52:18,400
heard of it?
What's the most important thing

960
00:52:18,400 --> 00:52:21,920
to you that you think about this
book?

961
00:52:26,240 --> 00:52:27,600
The greatest truth, the only
truth.

962
00:52:27,840 --> 00:52:32,000
God is your Father, you know,
and that has the Urantia book

963
00:52:32,640 --> 00:52:38,280
opens a window on the
magnificent heritage that is

964
00:52:38,280 --> 00:52:42,280
there for you.
You know, like it's hard to

965
00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:45,560
imagine the glories of God, you
know and in even the old

966
00:52:45,560 --> 00:52:48,200
scripture says I have not seen
even not heard nor is an

967
00:52:48,200 --> 00:52:50,920
interesting the heart of man.
That's what you with those who

968
00:52:50,920 --> 00:52:54,160
love God and seek to do his will
and even when Jesus was on earth

969
00:52:54,160 --> 00:52:56,920
and he spoke to his disciples in
the in in the New Testament, you

970
00:52:56,920 --> 00:52:59,320
see, and I have told you over
two things and you have not

971
00:52:59,320 --> 00:53:01,160
believed.
How much more so would you not

972
00:53:01,160 --> 00:53:02,760
believe We're ready to tell you
of heavenly kings.

973
00:53:03,200 --> 00:53:06,160
So we then we know that when
Jesus was alive that he didn't

974
00:53:06,400 --> 00:53:10,160
he he restricted his bestowed
experience, his revelation to

975
00:53:10,160 --> 00:53:13,000
this revelation Father and not
revelation heavenly things.

976
00:53:13,320 --> 00:53:16,240
And to me the Uranti book is a
glimpse of the heavenly glories

977
00:53:16,240 --> 00:53:19,480
that await us.
It is a magnificent revelation

978
00:53:19,480 --> 00:53:24,000
of the life of Jesus and of the
glories that await us and in our

979
00:53:24,000 --> 00:53:27,120
divine adventure towards the
realization of our divine

980
00:53:27,120 --> 00:53:30,960
destiny and unity with God.
It's a fantastic, fantastic

981
00:53:30,960 --> 00:53:35,200
piece of literature and it's
worth the reason if if a person

982
00:53:35,200 --> 00:53:39,920
genuine, genuinely loves Jesus,
then they cannot read this book

983
00:53:39,920 --> 00:53:42,000
and not be changed by it for the
better.

984
00:53:42,480 --> 00:53:45,440
Again, thank you Barry Culligan
for dropping by.

985
00:53:46,200 --> 00:53:48,000
I think this was a great
episode.

986
00:53:48,000 --> 00:53:51,880
We covered so much and I really
appreciate the insight that you

987
00:53:51,880 --> 00:53:55,320
brought to the program that's
going to do it for this episode

988
00:53:55,320 --> 00:53:58,600
of the Urantia Radio Podcast.
Of course, you know you can

989
00:53:58,600 --> 00:54:02,280
reach out to me
urantiabookradio@gmail.com,

990
00:54:02,800 --> 00:54:07,120
urantiabookradio@gmail.com and
we'll see you next time.

991
00:54:20,000 --> 00:55:17,840
The
the the

992
00:55:45,200 --> 00:56:47,720
None,
None,

993
00:57:07,960 --> 00:57:08,080
None.